I hadn’t seen that before the change? I didn’t even know there was one.

https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=213095

https://discuss.getsol.us/d/6564-cant-boot-into-the-lts-kernel/3

https://discuss.getsol.us/d/4899-let-s-talk-about-the-lts-kernels

lts kernels should not be used with newer hardware… because they don’t have modern software support, anyone that uses modern hardware risks being unable to boot with them. I shouldn’t have said crashes but the issues are numerous.

The second thing doesn’t require a source, they don’t have the manpower to implement it in cinnamon, look at the github pulse: https://github.com/linuxmint/cinnamon/pulse

https://wiki.debian.org/Wayland debian, notorious for being the most stable distro by far already uses it by default…

At this point I don’t even know what that means because maybe you have some other weird definition to pull out of your ass. Give me that in 5th grader level.

i have only used industry standard terminology and what I said is straightforward… kernel has drivers, old kernel no has new drivers, new drivers needed for hardware support, lts kernel old.

Mint focuses on stability reliability as evident from its decision to use Ubuntu LTS versions as it’s base. In case I need to spell it out, LTS versions are generally more reliable.

This is false, they’re just less likely to change. They can crash more frequently.

And you brought up X11 as a negative, but there’s a good reason Mint is staying on X11. Yes, Wayland is the future and eventually Mint will adopt Wayland as well, when Wayland becomes more stable reliable. I’m the mean time Mint stays on X11 because X11 is very stable reliable, extremely stable reliable compared to Wayland if you have an Nvidia card.

There’s no evidence that X11 is less reliable than wayland, and the reason mint stays on x11 has NOTHING to do with this, and everything to do with cinnamon not yet supporting it…

Mint also has better out the box support. For example to my knowledge for Nvidia Fedora comes with Nouvuea drivers which means for gaming you need to go through an extra process to get proprietary drivers. Mint has out the box support for Nvidia drivers. This is less of a thing when compared to Bazzite, but still a reason why to pick Mint as a beginner distro.

This is still false, stable distros have worse support out of the box because they use an older kernel version and the kernel ships the drivers.

That set of fixes still left everything being wrong or unsupported by any evidence.

…but that still means everything I said is correct and you were a jerk to me for being correct, no?

is it my fault you don’t know these things and instead of having a learning attitude, you say I have no idea what I’m talking about and am a flat earther when you don’t even know what defines a stable distro?

even if I use your uninformed definition it’s still wrong… there is no evidence fedora crashes more than mint, or is less reliable…

I did not invent this definition, it is industry standard…

https://bitdepth.thomasrutter.com/2010/04/02/stable-vs-stable-what-stable-means-in-software/

you’re very confident and not well informed.

“A stable software release is so named because it is unchanging.  Its behaviour, functionality, specification or API is considered ‘final’ for that version.  Apart from security patches and bug fixes, the software will not change for as long as that version of the software is supported, usually from 1 to many years.”

your first point even directly contradicts your second…

Do you have evidence of this?

Mint focuses on stability as evident from its decision to use Ubuntu LTS versions as it’s base. In case I need to spell it out, LTS versions are generally more stable and reliable.

Stability is essential for industry applications, but is actually TERRIBLE for beginners, especially ones that want to game. I could go into the reasons why, but I doubt you care. I don’t agree that this is a selling point for beginners in the first place, which is why I didn’t mention it. Stability does not mean “does not crash” in a linux context, it means UNCHANGING. Extremely old software is not good for beginners who want things to just work.

And you brought up X11 as a negative, but there’s a good reason Mint is staying on X11. Yes, Wayland is the future and eventually Mint will adopt Wayland as well, when Wayland becomes more stable. I’m the mean time Mint stays on X11 because X11 is very stable, extremely stable compared to Wayland if you have an Nvidia card.

Give me evidence that there are more issues with wayland than X11 and i’ll believe you.

Mint also has better out the box support. For example to my knowledge for Nvidia Fedora comes with Nouvuea drivers which means for gaming you need to go through an extra process to get proprietary drivers. Mint has out the box support for Nvidia drivers. This is less of a thing when compared to Bazzite, but still a reason why to pick Mint as a beginner distro.

Bazzite fixes this and is why I recommend it over fedora kinoite. Irrelevant point, not actually true, actually, the opposite is true precisely because of the last point. You realize stability means out of date kernel versions, and out of date kernel versions means… worse out of the box support!

And the reason people recommend Mint is in those first two points. Mint deliberately sacrifices fancy bells and whistles to be as stable as possible. You not knowing that shows how little you know about Mint.

Wellp, those are bad points, which is why i didn’t make them, sorry!

But I don’t think that’s true at all.

No, not at all, twitter is not decentralized, with a lemmy instance, if you leave, you lose nothing at all. With twitter, you can’t take the content or your account

You were also unable to, at this point, i’m convinced you’re trolling. Sorry, it’s just not a good choice. And I gave legitimate reasons for why it was great in the past, you just didn’t like them!

Having a great GUI, easy installation, a bunch of guides, and being the most well-supported are all perfectly valid reasons to use mint like 10 years ago.

Interesting strategy: “make my argument for me!”

“Oh, you couldn’t make my argument for me? why would I trust you?”

That’s a bad example because it got forked and it wasn’t an actual problem?

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but aren’t the main dev(s) members of lemmy.ml[3]? So I can certainly see how differing political views could skew the development of the main branch of Lemmy.

People say this all the time but never can give even one example of a potential problem. Preemptive forking sounds insane to me. The notion that lemmy might enshittify because you don’t like their politics is also ridiculous when their politics are anti-capitalist… aka the politics that are least likely to enshittify.

Beingly highly supported is a prerequisite to being a good beginner distro, but it’s not a reason to recommend a distro. If we take it as a reason then Mint having a GUI is also a reason to recommend to beginners.

Mint having a GUI IS a good reason to recommend it to beginners… Arch for example has terrible GUI support, which is why it’s not a good choice for beginners (don’t get me started on manjaro…)

Guides in general are good, but I doubt any beginner actually cares about guides, unless it’s a guide telling you what to click where on the GUI.

This is simply not true, i’ve given linux to countless people, people always google how to do things and end up with guides for a different distro, i’ve seen this happen countless times because I specialize in giving beginners linux. They absolutely do care about this, and it’s extremely commonly cited as one of the reasons to go with mint.

Instead of playing the prying game where I keep prying until you give straight answers (because people don’t love Mint just because it’s an Ubuntu fork) I’m just going to conclude that either you deliberately don’t want to say why people recommend Mint to beginners or you actually don’t know why people recommend Mint. I don’t care which it is because both invalidate your opinion of the Mint suggestion being outdated.

I think it’s a bad recommendation mainly made for legacy reasons rather than current ones, that was very clear. Give me reasons it’s a good one, I used to use mint, I gave plenty of reasons for why it’s a bad choice. You’ve given nothing in support of it, and expected me to write your argument for you?

Of course the person on the side of mint being a bad choice… doesn’t think it’s a good choice? I gave the only reasons you’d want to use mint, tbh. Aside from that there’s literally no reason to over fedora. Feel free to prove me wrong with a list.

Somehow you think the ease of use isn’t relevant because it also applies to Fedora, but support is relevant despite it also applying to Fedora? How about some consistency in your arguments.

Are you deliberately misinterpreting me? Are you actually trolling here?

My point was obvious, fedora and mint are both equally easy to use, so, ease of use is not a factor when deciding between them… in fact, fedora is EASIER to use (flatpak meaning completely gui updates, kde being hugely standardized and well-developed), so, if it is a factor, it makes fedora a better choice than mint.

It’s obvious that ease of use is a massive factor for recommending a distro to a beginner, it’s just that ease of use doesn’t favor mint.

Oh there will be a boom of… abandoned babies for the fostercare system.

That does NOT have very little to do with beginners, being a highly supported distro is one of the most important things for beginners, having guides for how to do things written specifically for your distro is fantastic for new people.

It being beloved is why it’s recommended, yes, and that doesn’t benefit new people, but that’s an obvious reason why one might recommend it…

There’s also the fact that it’s designed to be easy to use, but that also applies to fedora, and fedora is significantly more well-developed, so it’s not really relevant here.

I don’t see how, it’s covered by a good license, and if it did it’d be forked in an instant. Can you give a historical example?

It’s well out of the testing phase and used by default on both major desktops.

It’s impossible by design. If an instance enshittifies people will just leave the instance.

Ubuntu, the release right before unity was the one I started actually using.

After that I switched to arch for a very long time, and now i’m on nixos.

Back then ubuntu had pretty much all of linux cornered, the vast majority of distros were ubuntu based or ubuntu adjacent, and ubuntu was beloved, however, it came with a number of flaws, mint just rectified those flaws and was otherwise basically just ubuntu.

By being ubuntu based and getting rid of the stuff that made people angry, you ended up with a highly supported, beloved distro. These days things have changed, however, fedora is just as if not more well supported than ubuntu, same with arch based distros.

Dunno, a long time ago at this point.