You’re super pretty! And your eyeliner is so good too, I’m jealous lol.

Yeah agreed. That’s not the situation here though since none of us, me included, know what the woman in this post looks like, whether she’s had bottom surgery, etc. And neither did her date since all she said was “I’m trans.”

I never actually called the date a transphobe or a bigot to be clear. I said he did something transphobic, which I stand by, but the point of my post was venting about how when this trans women was trying to complain about her shitty date experience, a bunch of cis women in the replies took the opportunity to soapbox about how dating preferences are valid, rather than comfort her like how they would normally react to a similar post where a girl got dumped in the middle of a date. That was the point of my post, it had almost nothing to do with the date outside of me trying to add context. You came into the comment section to do the same thing I was complaining about the cis people in that post doing. This post was never supposed to be about whether dating preferences are transphobic, I offhandedly mentioned it in 1 line of the original post and only started actually talking about it when like 3 different people came in to “offer nuance” to a discussion I wasn’t fucking trying to have! I wasn’t the one who started the arguments lmao.

I literally am OP, I know what the post I’m referring to said. I’m saying the person rejected her for a transphobic reason, not that he himself was like a massive raging bigot. Something someone does can be transphobic while not themselves being a transphobe.

You are aware that people can interalize bigotry in a way where the person can otherwise be very supportive but still have unconscious biases or unfounded beliefs that only occassionly slip through in specific situations right? That’s a major cause of things like micro aggressions or stereotypes that while not necessarily intentional or meant to be harmful are nonetheless, and is something worth examining to hopefully be able to rid yourself of. No-one is trying to force someone to date a trans person here, we’re just saying if you blanket would never date a trans person it’s probably worth examining your internal biases and beliefs.

Yeah agreed and I mean the risks of current hrt are really minor, I know the most about estrogen so I’ll tall about that, but even blood clots on doses that are too high is debated since a lot of the studies on that were with non-bioidentical types of estradiol iirc. The cancer risk they brought up also literally just changes the chances of you developing certain types of cancer to basically what the risks for a cis person who naturally has those hormones is. Same with any kind of clotting disorders, it just makes it closer to the risks of a cis women. No cis women with clotting disorders or a history of cancer are being prescribed estrogen blockers preemptively to reduce their risks of those.

But also like, should the government restrict purchases of every single thing that could harm someone? I truly believe somerthing like a knife, or certain power tools are honestly more likely to cause injury than hrt, same with alcohol as well obviously. IDK why medicine specifically requires protecting people from more than any of those.

The fact its specifically "" and “;” makes it seem really likely they’re worried about SQL injections, meaning they must be using a super insecure SQL library and also sticking the password directly in the SQL query (so definitely no hashing)

Leaving stuff up the governing bodies is literally how it used to be and is the thing trans people are arguing for lol. Republicans want us banned at a federal level.

Again, no one is saying anyone is obligated to date anyone. I’ve repeatedly said the opposite this whole time.

That being said, dating preferences or choosing not to date someone can be rooted in bigotry. Idk if you’re arguing the opposite, but dating preferences aren’t some thing that’s magically immune from being bigoted. As an extreme example, a Nazi could refuse to date any non-aryan and that’s obviously because of the fact they’re a Nazi. A person could be into Latinas because they fetishize them, that’s rooted in bigotry. And a person can refuse to date a trans person because of the fact they’re trans and that can be bigoted.

All the examples you’ve been giving are things people don’t face widespread discrimination for, which makes them not equivalent. And no one said anything about the date calling the girl ugly either?

But if a person doesn’t date a trans person because they’re trans they need a really good reason to justify it to make me not assume they have some level of internalized transphobia.

But what about being trans specifically makes someone potentially less attractive. With country music its a difference in music taste. What fundamental thing do trans people have that causes a loss of attraction. The only thing you keep saying is because of their asab. That’s what’s transphobic, it is treating a trans person as different than a cis person because of the fact they’re trans.

IDK what else I can say to drive home the fact that seeing a trans person as unattractive because of how they were assigned at birth is just a woke way of saying they aren’t really their gender, which is the most basic type of transphobia.

Yeah I considered mentioning that too but didn’t think it was worth it lmao

That’s not what I’m saying though, like my response to the other comment said a hypothetical person who has never been attracted to a trans person wouldn’t be transphobic. The internalized transphobia comes into play if they are attracted to a trans person, and then lose that attraction once learning they’re trans. Those are very different scenarios, and one is transphobic. No trans person is trying to force cis people to date us, that’s stupid.

But that feeling of not wanting to be with a person because they’re trans is transphobia. He might not be outwardly bigoted, but I’m fairly confident he has some level of internalized transphobia. The only way that sort of thing can happen is to believe that fundamentally trans people are different than cis people of the same gender in a negative way. Like the other comments mentioned, the same thing is true for other marginalized groups. A man going from attracted to a white passing woman into losing that attraction upon realizing she isn’t white is because of racism.

But what about “being trans” can immediately make someone less attractive? Nothing about her physically changed, other than her revealing a medical detail about her past pretty much. It wasn’t about her not being able to get pregnant since the date didn’t mention that as a reason why, and there’s no indication of whether or not the girl had any kind of bottom surgery.

Edit: Also check out this other comment in the thead for a more detailed answer, I assumed you were that person responding at first so I treated my reply as basically a follow-up meaning its not as fleshed out.

Here’s an actual study on it. Basically, trans women have slightly more lean muscle on average, but otherwise are statistically the same as a cis woman in terms of actual strength and cardiovascular strength.

Like I said in the previous response as well, its not “just playing sports” the same way segregation wasn’t “just water fountains”. As a trans leftist I will not vote for any candidate who is in favor of sports bans, (as would a lot of other trans people). And trans people tend to be very left leaning, so by espousing those viewpoints it would cost the progressive candidate votes.

Yeah like the other reply said, I wouldn’t consider a hypothetical person who just hasn’t ever been attracted to a trans person transphobic. I genuinely don’t believe that actually exists outside of aro/ace people who experience no attraction though, since trans people can 100% pass as their gender and live completely stealth, so statistically it feels unlikely that someone could avoid ever feeling attracted to a trans person. If someone (like the original posters date) was attracted to a trans person up until the point they realized they were trans though, that’s 100% at the very least internalized transphobia.

Edit: And because trans people or people of color or any other group are so diverse it feels disingenuous to believe a person could genuinely be completely devoid of attraction to that group without some underlying bigotry. Even the examples you gave of innocuous criteria, I find it truly hard to believe that a person could honestly lose all attraction to someone because of their eye color or hair color, who they’d otherwise find attractive.

Yeah no you’re good I didn’t take your reply in a bad way don’t worry, I was 100% just continuing to vent haha. And yeah it was a reddit post lmao (I basically only use redlib to read a couple of the trans communities and there was a different post in one of them venting about it that made me see it in the first place). It is definitely something where going outside of actual trans spaces and reading discussions about trans issues, even in “trans inclusive” ones, really sucks I think, I try not to do it often but it’s hard to resist sometimes even when I know it will just make me feel bad lol.

Yeah exactly like this is a post about a girl having a shitty experience with a guy, they get posts like this all the fucking time. It’s practically the point of the community! Only on this one did the comments turn into lecturing the girl for expressing frustration at her date and dating in general though, mysteriously.

Honestly the issue wasn’t as much the date as it was the replies to the post though. Like it was shitty of the guy to reject a girl he was otherwise entirely attracted to because of the fact she was trans, but it was just the lack of empathy in the comments and the way they defended the guy rather than expressing sympathy that really struck me the wrong way.

I do think not wanting to date any trans person is transphobic though imo. All of the common arguments people make to justify it are things that either aren’t true of every trans person or are things that can also apply to cis people of the same gender too. Its obviously not “you have to be attracted to me or you’re transphobic” but if you’re willing to completely claim you’d not be attracted to a single member of a minority it comes from internalized bigotry imo. The same thing would be true for people of color or any other marginalized group too. I feel like the situation in the post is pretty similar to if a man was on a date with a women who was white passing, and once he found out she wasn’t actually white was suddenly not attracted to her. I couldn’t read that as any way but racism the same way I can’t read the man she was on a date with going from very attracted to no attraction on a dime as anything but transphobia.

It wasn’t the guy as much as all the replies from a bunch of cis women, tons of who were self-described “allies”. They’re the ones who really annoyed me, since they were minimizing what the guy did or trying to justify it because “it’s not transphobic to not want to date a trans woman”, or “maybe he wants kids”, etc