- cross-posted to:
- europe@feddit.org
- world@quokk.au
- cross-posted to:
- europe@feddit.org
- world@quokk.au
The products covered by the obligation to repair currently include:
- washing machines and washer-dryers
- dishwashers
- refrigerators
- electronic displays
- welding equipment
- servers and data storage products
- mobile phones, cordless phones and tablets
- tumble dryers
- e-bikes and e-scooters batteries (from 18 February 2027)
- local space heaters
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They won’t make it so we can install any OS we want on tablets or phones, nor make drivers published as free software, right?
We absolutely need to fight for a “software right to repair”
Well done Europe! It should make it possible for other industries too!
Can’t wait to see what loopholes they will implement such that I can avoid repairing my shit and pay full price for a new one anyway because the repair costs just as much as a new one. God forbid replacing a single bearing instead of the whole wash drum, I hope the EU protects me from that like before.
You can repair it, you just need a proprietary driver, a torque wrench, 5 hands, 18 fingers, and wait 5 months for the part to arrive.
Or just take it to our shop where you can spend 250 bucks to fix your 260 dollar dryer.
I’m excited for an international business to sell a different version of the item for the EU which is “repairable”, and one for the US which is riveted and welded closed.
I wonder if this will mean screwed split-half washing machine drums, for example.
One of the most common failure points in washing machines is the drum bearing. Nowadays almost all makes are using drums where the halves of the drum are plastic, welded together, where they used to be screwed together. The welds prevent opening the drum, and make bearing replacement basically impossible. The makes will sell you a replacement of the whole assembly, but it will often cost like 2/3 of a new machine. This means that a bearing failure often results in chucking a machine that used to be repaired for a cost under a 100 € if done professionally, or tens if DIY.
I imagine the “whole assembly” concept will be used as one of the loopholes.
That specifically is such a naked example of planned obolescence i’m still salty that was not already illegal.
I was fuming when the bearing on my Bosh washing machine wore out and without batting an eyelid they wanted to sell me the whole drum assembly. Including mounting springs. Instead of just some bearings.
For the unitiated, that is roughly 70 percent of all the components in the whole machine. Other than the drum assembly there’s basicly only some logic boards, some plumbing and the motor.
All that to replace a 20 euro bearing. Which is a “wear part” by the way and should therefore 100 percent be serviceable.
There is no repair without firmware. All hardware needs to be documented and ship with source. It hasn’t been enough to be able to buy physical parts since perhaps the 80s or 90s. Everything is controlled by software. Without that right to repair is a joke. Meanwhile the surveillance industry and their well greased govt supporters are trying to lock down software. Can’t have it both ways.
They pass dystopian chat control with one hand and does this with the other.
The EU is a complex organization with different power poles and a variety of different interests. Add to that members of parliament do not always understand everything they vote for. And yes: you get bad things, nonsensical rules, but also good things.
Overall, I would say it’s positive, but when it’s bad it can be brutal.
Edit: I forgot to mention lobbying! Brussels is full of lobbyists!
It is also influenced by us, those who vote in the election of the European Union. The European Greens and Socialist & Democrats have lost quite a bit of influence since the last period.
Yes there are many lobbyists at Brussels and that’s a problem. Sorry for not being as cynical as you.
Seriously, talk about major whiplash with how they do things lmao
All those people in Brussels are out of touch. They live in their own world.
A world where there is right to repair.
Makes you think, right? Almost as if the narrative about how dystopian chat control is and how evil EU is doesn’t really add up and it’s just people repeating some bullshit they read on a blog.
There is a lot of anti-EU propaganda, especially surrounding the Chat Control.
Yes, there are some authoritarian politicians trying to push it through. But there is a reason why it has failed so many times. Because most EU politicians are really not that bad.
The propaganda is being pushed by Russia to sow discontent in the EU. That is why you see on every positive EU story, there is someone in the comment going “What about Chat Control though?” As if that proves the EU is evil.
As if that proves the EU is evil.
It sure as hell proves evil intent.
We’re lucky there’s a majority against chat control but that still means there was a minority proposing it.
And i don’t think the divide is that bigIt only proves evil intent of those specific politicians trying to push it through.
It doesn’t prove any evil intent from anything else in the EU.
The EU is a democracy. Which means that we sometimes also let evil people talk.
Sure, they can talk, to an extent, and act… to a much lesser extend, unless you want to go down a slippery slope.
Well when you think about it this is just another form of control over businesses. That’s equally authoritarian.
If businesses were people that’d be a great point.
can we have this in America? Answer: No! in fact in America everything popular in other countries is banned unless it’s used in federal buildings because “security concerns”. yeah… sure… so very worried about “national security” that security risks can only be used in government buildings and not in private homes… yeah sure… that’s secure.
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Unfortunately there are some exemptions. Flexible / folding displays are not covered. Fitness trackers and watches are not covered.
There is also a battery regulation coming in next year to require phone batteries to be replaceable with no tools but that has loop holes too - long life batteries aren’t covered, IP67 rated phones aren’t covered. So you can bet your boots those two reasons will be what makers use to bullshit their way out of it.
Having those rules is much better than not having them. Also, IP rating is not enough, batteries also need to have sufficient load cycles. So if it forces them to use only long life batteries that reduces the need for battery repkacements and is already something.
Well it’s a start.
Also software… I would love to have regulations that make it clear that the root of trust on all devices need to start by the owner of the device, not by the vendor… That would allow the end users to repair the software on their devices… Replacing it with whatever else they want. Next would be to provide hardware documentation to the owners to program their own devices… I don’t expect that to happen, but I can dream.
The root of trust can never be on the owner of the device for anything that requires actual security.
I disagree. For any actual security, the owner of the secrets is the only one that can be trusted. It is their secrets. Their own interest to keep them save.
Any company or government is a shifting entity, maybe now they are trustworthy, but maybe in some years they aren’t.
Owners are the only stabile point, because it is their data. They should be able to transfer the trust to a company or government to handle security, but they also need to be able to take away that trust and access, and either handle it themselves or transfer that trust to some other entity.
It is not okay for companies or government to hold the data of individuals hostage… That is not security, that is a business strategy.
If the only person that can verify the safety of your device is the owner, that device will and should be marked as insecure and not to be trusted in any instance where security matters.
Are you talking about owner safety, or some bussiness security. Yes the device is ‘insecure’ if you are taking the point of view of DRM provider or software vendor who wants to make sure advertisements are displayed, etc. Or if your software actual security depends of taking control away from the user. But actual end user security does not have to depend on that.
I’m talking about every service that you use your device for. They will not and should not trust some random phone owner that their device is secure and safe to let use their services. They will, however, trust Google saying that the device is secure and not tampered with - as they should.
Secure services should always have limited trust to user data and devices. Security built on ‘Google says the device is secure’ is broken. Yes, it is convenient fir service providers who do not care about their customer rights, but more for ‘intellectual property’ and liability.
Lots of apllications still work in web browsers without TPM-based, kernel level DRMs and many of them are still reasonably secure. They are built with the assumption user controls their device. This has always been possible and still is possible. Just inconvenient for corporations.
You are not giving a reason for your statement. The owner is the one that bought a device. The sole arbiter about what a device should do or shouldn’t do. The person responsible of the device. The owner must trust their device in order for the device to be trusted. It doesn’t matter what if other people do or do not trust that device, they are not the owners. They should take care to protect their own data on their own devices.
The reason is obvious, which is why I didn’t think I had to say it lol
Imagine if you went to work at a bank in IT for example. They issue you a laptop. You go “oh no it’s ok I’ll use my own, I assure you it’s secure and safe”.
You connect to their network and instantly their network is compromised, every device on the whole network gets a cryptolocker virus.
You said it was secure though, so how did this happen?
You can trust it all you want, but other systems absolutely do not have to, and anything that requires security assurances will not and should not trust it. The device owners word/assurance means nothing.
Imagine if you went to work at a bank in IT for example. They issue you a laptop.
Who is the owner of that device? The Bank.
Who is the owner of that network? The Bank.
So they are the arbiter of trust in that area. They are free to exclude non-bank-owned devices.
I work in IT, and I’m fine with getting a company laptop for company work. I don’t trust that laptop. I isolate it when I work at home. But the company trusts it, and that is fine.
Flexible / folding displays are not covered
So that’s why after almost a decade, only now Apple is ready to launch their foldable
Those aren’t loopholes though, they’re part of the legislation. Phone makers don’t need to “bullshit” their way out of anything if they meet the criteria, which almost every mobile phone released these days does - making the regulation pretty pointless lol
Fitness trackers would be hard to make them easy repairable, when most of them is waterproof
Gaskets are a thing. Many, many, many watches would brag about their water resistance up to 10, 50, 100 meters depth. So I don’t think the excuse is credible.
Water resistance does not mean what people think. ISO 22810 says that a 3 bar (30m) water resistant is “Not suitable for showering, bathing, swimming, snorkeling, water related work, fishing, and diving.”
30m. Not. Suitable. for. showering.
Also, most really waterproof watches, 100m+, have small circular metal cases with metal backs that are screwed shut against a gasket. Some, like G-Shocks, have a proportionally thick stainless steel backplate screwed down, but the plate is what? 3 cm. Diagonal?
Doing so on a thin rectangular device with a reasonable cost is near impossible, too much flex.
Water kettle stopped working, has fucking temper proof triangle head screws so can’t even open it without having to buy a special screwdriver bit. name and shame : kitchenaid
Malfunctioning water kettles are like one of the biggest causes of houses burning down.
Those not being repairable is a good thing. Because it would only cause more houses to burn down when everyone with a screwdriver can mess up the wiring.
I can go one further, if you ever want to do a warrenty claim with coffeemate, regardless of how small, they require you to cut the power cord.
I bought a cheap coffeemate coffee maker, and the anti-splash valve that prevents it from brewing fell off, and I lost the o-ring that was part of it as a result.
After 3 different contact points with coffee mate as their public listed email only warranty contact was incorrect and then was bounced to a couple more emails, they agreed it was a manufacturer problem, and that it was covered, but they wanted me to cut the power cord and show proof that the unit was no longer functional, because instead of sending me a 10¢ if that o ring, they wanted me to destroy a other than that one comp a perfectly functional unit, so they could send a whole new unit in it’s place.
I bought a cheap oring set on amazon, so now I have more than I would ever need of orings but, at least it’s less wasteful.
Hold on, don’t they know a cut cord can be soldered back together? You don’t even need image generators to fake breaking it…
They don’t care if you do that, because if you do that they’re in no way responsible for it anymore. If you do that and it burns your house down it’s all on you.
yea I found it weird as well. I assume they figure most people don’t have the skills to just connect it again.
When I was looking into it, it’s common practice for kitchen appliance warranties to have that as a requirement for warranty support when they are giving a replacement, likely they are trying to disincentivize someone getting a replacement for a minor issue, and then reselling one of the two appliances they have to make a profit, which I do understand for replacements but… in my case why not just send the replacement part… it likely could even go via an envelope and only pay the price of a stamp.
Theres no way paying to send a whole coffee maker is cheaper than sending a o-ring or a washer…
One of the few good uses for AI, to generate photos or video of the device with the cord cut
Mine had Philips screws and was easy to open, but the switch that was broken proved impossible to find as a spare part. It’s a shame that I have to bin something that should’ve been easy to repair.
Most of the time it’s not about repairability it’s about mitigation of responsibility. If they make it difficult to get into and you do it anyway then burn your house down because you removed the thermistor they have a better case in court.
That’s the thing about repairing things at home or anywhere else. You need tools to do so and more than just a screwdriver and a pair of pliers. You often special tools. You can get a set of triangle bits for maybe 4 to 5 euros and you will have them for life. So don’t be a cheap. Either fix that kettle yourself, pay someone with the skills and tools to fix it, or buy a new one. But don’t whinge about not having tools.
And let’s also be honest. Some things need to be tamper proof. Most of you ain’t smart enough and experienced enough to play with things that can injure/kill you or others, no matter how many youtube videos you watch.
A eater kettle does not have that much stuff inside that it should be tamlre proof for fuck’s sake. It can use normal screws like phillips, hex or torx.
Maybe electric kettles are different where you live, but they are extremely dangerous because of the amount of power needed to heat water to 100degreesC quickly. Iirc some countries don’t even have them because their house can’t provide enough power.
if its an electric kettle, I have to disagree. Those have the equivalent of a stovetop going through them when in use, and have a degree of water protection required. I heavily disagree with easy to access and remove screws on those. I still think they should be consumer repairable but, I think buying a set of P screwdrivers or whatever style they choose is a more than secure enough method of protecting people who don’t realize what they are doing.
Being said, many things that do have tamper or non-standard screws I think shouldn’t like the iphones, but I think appliances that have a burner element or a higher power draw should remain one of them.
Phones absolutely should have screws like they have though, as flathead and philips head, especially at that size, are way too prone to burring.
They’re not even really “non standard” screws at this point. Anyone can buy a screwdriver set for a few bucks to disassemble an iPhone.
Yeah but if you’re opening high power stuff while it’s plugged in thats on you. I get tamper protection on power supplies and stuff where you could get shocked by a capacitor. But a big heater not plugged in is harmless
Even if it’s unplugged first, I strongly disagree with the insinuation that since it’s unplugged it’s harmless. This is a device that uses the same amount of power draw as a stove top and has water contact as part of it’s daily use. If someone who doesn’t know what they’re doing decides they want to access it, and does it incorrectly, it has the capability of burning your house down.
Having a standard screw on it like a Phillips or a regular screwdriver significantly lowers the barrier of entry in allowing someone who doesn’t know what they’re doing to work on the equipment, which is why I think it’s fair that a component that has that capability has a something like a hex or a p bit. Those are both something that are not hard to obtain, but also something that you likely won’t find just randomly laying around in your house unless you already regularly work on devices or equipment.
Sorry but as long as it’s unplugged it’s literally just a bunch of wire. Wire by itself even a heating coil has no way of burning your house down while unplugged.
I think you may have misread or misinterpreted the comment. Probably my fault for not making it clear, the “harmless” nature is removed when its plugged back in again, not during the repair. It’s a different point of the repair process.
But unless you understand the electrical components and the rules and codes in their use for consumer safety, maybe, just maybe, it should be a little bit difficult to gain access to if your 10 years old.
Go buy some bloody tools and quit your whinging.
Yeah sure I’m gonna buy stupid triangle screwdrivers so my nonexistent 10yo cannot open the heater.
If the said 10yo knows where the tools are it does not matter what kind of screws there are. It just makes me have to buy stupid tools I will only ever use for one appliance.
If it bothers you, buy a thread gauge and replace the triangle head with something you like better.
I dont have such a kettle the issue is when you buy the tools to rekove the screws it males no sense to bother changing the screws anymore
Yeah, it’s more of a personal preference thing.
I would recommend against doing that to begin with since plug in kitchen appliances especially need to respond in a safe way to shorts and even the basic barrier to entry that some weird screw presents is enough to make a person who might inadvertently kill themselves or someone else slow their roll.
But you can for a very low price acquire the tools to allow you to open many objects.
Do cars next!!
I counter !fuckcars@lemmy.world
Thats the point: make them less “fucky”… Less noisy, polluting, dangerous, etc.
Hopefully, malicious compliance loopholes will be fixed eventually
When the EU mandated USB-C, Apple included a bullshit adapter so they could keep their proprietary charger. But of course if someone with an iPhone was visiting my house they wouldn’t have an adapter with them. Eventually the EU bitch-slapped Apple over that nonsense and now iPhones have USB-C for charging.
So, companies will definitely try to weasel out of serving consumers, and the EU will eventually sort them out.
Hopefully this will benefit other countries indirectly, instead of designing one repairable phone and one not repairable, should be easier to just design one.
“Hold my beer” - Nintendo, releasing an EU centric revision. Meanwhile Apple and Samsung are digging up every legal loophole to prevent the law applying to their devices.
Apple and Samsung be like: “It’s not a mobile phone or a tablet, it’s a phablet so it does not fall in to any category of the devices that need to be repairable.”
The loophole in the directive is smaller phones. Smartphones go from 10.16 cm (4 inches) diagonal to 17. 78cm (7 inches) and everything bigger (up to 44.2 cm) is a tablet.
Samsung and Apple’s flagship smartphones are very close to be considered tablets but that wouldn’t save them from the requirements.
Apple: hey fans, did you know the best phone is actually small?!!
I think Nintendo will transition to having only one version on the long term, precisely not to have to deal with two versions.
“Hold my beer” - Nintendo, releasing an EU centric revision.
i wonder, do we know what will be the price difference between the EU centric version and the international version?
iPhones are already super easy to repair. Apple have been at the forefront of this for years.
For the downvoters who are too blinded by their hate for Apple to believe facts:
https://www.ifixit.com/repairability/smartphone-repairability-scores
PROS
- Display and battery repairs are well-prioritized, though not as well as in other (dual-entry) iPhone models.
- Torx screws secure the battery assembly in place, making replacements straightforward.
- Repair parts and instructions are available straight from Apple.
CONS
- Five different screwhead types and the continued reliance on adhesives complicate basic repairs.
Are we talking about the same apple that invented a new type of screw to keep people from taking their phones apart? The same apple that once people could get a trilobe driver, then made it so that generic replacement screens would not work because of some protection from non-apple hardware? Then went on to make sure that you can’t use non-apple parts in a laptop?
Yes.
https://www.ifixit.com/repairability/smartphone-repairability-scores
PROS
- Display and battery repairs are well-prioritized, though not as well as in other (dual-entry) iPhone models.
- Torx screws secure the battery assembly in place, making replacements straightforward.
- Repair parts and instructions are available straight from Apple.
CONS
- Five different screwhead types and the continued reliance on adhesives complicate basic repairs.
the same apple that locks individual parts of devices to user accounts so that they can’t be used for repair?
Sounds like this is to prevent theft for parts. Considering it says right there that parts can be unlocked with the user’s account. So it’s the same mechanism that makes a stolen iPhone non-functional unless unlocked by the user.
sure but what if you buy one for parts?
Ask the previous owner to remove the locking, same way as they would need to if you bought the device to use it. What’s the problem?
Again, says right there they should just remove the device from ‘Find my’, which disables Activation Lock, the very same feature that prevents theft for reselling the device for regular use.
Instead of using Repair Assistant to unlock the part, you can remove Activation Lock using Find My.
what if the phone is broken and has been disassembled?
Same Apple. Signing new parts to your device is incredibly simple and DIY now.
https://www.ifixit.com/repairability/smartphone-repairability-scores
PROS
- Display and battery repairs are well-prioritized, though not as well as in other (dual-entry) iPhone models.
- Torx screws secure the battery assembly in place, making replacements straightforward.
- Repair parts and instructions are available straight from Apple.
CONS
- Five different screwhead types and the continued reliance on adhesives complicate basic repairs.
…but only if you buy the parts new.
I wouldn’t want to be putting second hand parts in my phone when repairing it. I can’t imagine there are many second hand screens or batteries around for sale given they’re the things that are replaced the most.
Not that I’d ever want a second hand screen or battery anyway.
i’m perfectly fine with buying third-party components.
Not an option if you love somewhere where official parts are not for sale.
Super easy to repair by certified repair shops or easy to repair by people at home with minimal tool requirements?
At home with minimal tool requirements
https://www.ifixit.com/repairability/smartphone-repairability-scores
PROS
- Display and battery repairs are well-prioritized, though not as well as in other (dual-entry) iPhone models.
- Torx screws secure the battery assembly in place, making replacements straightforward.
- Repair parts and instructions are available straight from Apple.
CONS
- Five different screwhead types and the continued reliance on adhesives complicate basic repairs.
Company that rates self repairability of phones: iPhones are easy to repair by yourself using basic tools
Lemmy: no, that can’t be true because we hate apple
Not bad by the standards of modern phones, but hopefully not good enough for the new EU standards. Imo adhesives should only be used if they’re replaceable or reusable and the screws should be limited to philips and flatheads.
hard disagree on the screws:
philps and flatheads can be damaged too easily: torx or nothing!
these teeny tiny screws are really finicky and both philips and flatheads are prone to slipping, causing faster wear and easily leading to stripped screws…
any design that is inherently resistant to that is a must for small parts!
source: worked in a repair shop ;)
Sure thing, I don’t care much about the specific screw type, just that it’s a type that’s commonly available so you don’t need a unique screwdriver for each device you own.
PH screws can go to hell, they fucking suck I hate them. Flathead is just kind of annoying. Torx all the way, they are superior in every way.
No thank you on the flathead or Philips head screws, they get burred too easily which would basically leave your phone unrepairable.
The less adhesives the better though, agreed there. Their phones are already definitely self-repairable enough for the new EU rules.
/s?
Edited to add the single best source there is for the doubters and downvoters. Take a look.
You only need a screwdriver set and maybe some rubbing alcohol.
I have to admit that I haven’t checked ifix scores for a hot minute and am surprised that since the iphone 15 Apple consistently beats all other big brands in reparability score. Before that of course they were bad, which is probably why people remember them that way. I like that trend, hopefully Samsung and Google also hop on that bandwaggon any time soon.
Strange that 73 other people, 30+ of who downvoted long after I added the proof, think that ifixit are wrong.
I don’t think they have a problem with the ifixit scores, more with the words you have chosen to convey your message. Also of course you will not find any love for Big Tech in the Fediverse ;-)
My words were the truth, I guess that’s why they have an issue with them 🤣
Personally I downvoted you because you completely forgive/forget the older devices from Apple.
They had sold approximately 2.2 billions of impossible to repair devices before they kind of changed course with the iPhone 14 line.
But those devices don’t have to meet these laws, so they’re irrelevant.
I also didn’t say they have always been great, I said they’ve been at the forefront for years, which is true. Their recent phones are easier to repair than almost any other phones on the market.
well, one thing that surely is not repairable about apple is their software. you can’t fix their operating system by installing a more meaningful alternative to it on your device, can you?
What a ridiculous and pointless comment.
how is it ridiculous and pointless? fixing software is a big concern to me.
You imply it’s broken and that you could “fix” it. Both are untrue.
So I saw that my car offered up all sorts of useful diagnostic information for self diagnosing stuff. Was very excited and went to look at it for a generic fault without having to get software to tell me what the fault is. I thought "it’s stupid it has fully functional computer display yet tells me basically “contact a dealer, but it’s safe to drive” instead of what the problem is. Then I find out that because I’m in the USA, the company keeps it to themselves…
So if they see value in treating regions differently, they will absolutely go out of their way to screw over the regions that will let them.
Car manufacturers screwed over consumers the last 10-15 years big time! Cars used to be the big thing many could fix a lot on by themselves and were proud to do so. Then they basically just said incrementally to the DIY’ers “it’s all computers now, not your cup of tea”, purposely made cars less and less self repairable and got away with it! It’s infuriating.
Computers could make cars a lot more reliable and moddable. It’s proprietary/locked-down software and hardware that’s the problem.
Do you seriously think they computerized cars to make them less repairable? That’s some tin foil hat stuff there.
They started computerizing cars to make them more efficient, reliable (ironically), safer, etc. The problem is that beyond OBDII there is no standard for diagnostics, and makers keep these proprietary.
They didn’t have to keep it proprietary, and I think in many “computer problems” the certified dealers will just replace 1 circuitboard by a new one, but it’s a part which private customers are not able to order and replace themselves
They didn’t do it for that purpose, I am saying they used the opportunity of cars becoming more digital to make them less repairable outside of “certified dealers”
Exactly, repairing your car was even a very common trope in Home Improvement, which kind of catched the average American household of that time pretty well, or so at least to TVs best abilities to generalize
Okay, but the economics of doing that are different between software and hardware. It’s much more expensive to have a full second hardware design compared to just turning a software feature off in certain markets.
Yeah, I get the impression newer cars are designed to fail just outside warranty because the car companies make more on the dealerships repairs then they do on the sale of the car.
The past two phones I bought were not because they broke, but because they stopped being supported on apps that I need to use.
That’s also included in the directive. Manufactures will be required to provide OS updates for at least 5 years “from the date of end of placement on the market” (which means the date the brand shipped the last device of a model).
They also have 4 months to release security updates and 6 months for functionality updates see ANNEX II for all device categories.
That is actually fairly reasonable. I use a 5 yr old Xiaomi which a has 8Gb (as much as an entry level Surface or MacBook. Fuck AI) an octacore CPU, great camera, ultra fast charge, great battery etc. But I realize most people change phones every 2-3 years regardless of how well their phone works, because of “shiny new thing”
Xiaomi 13T gang? 😁
10T. Banger of a phone.
Actually pretty repairable despite the glued back.
So frigging good value it’s insane. Have had like the 2,5,7,8,9(kids) too, all super quality and cheap.
Let me guess, iPhone?
Androids
Huh…I’m guessing banking apps? Those are the only ones that have ever given me problems on old Android devices
I’ll literally change banks over that kind of thing now.
Been starting to see more randomly picky apps. Based on vintage and rooted device.
Uninstalled the FedEx app, since every time I tapped on a tracking number, it would divert to the app which would promptly shame me for having a rooted device and refuse to run.
yes
Doubtful. iPhones have the longest support of any phones out there.
Source?
As far as I know, nearly all flagship phones, Apple or otherwise, get about 7 years of update support (
except Pixel phones with GrapheneOS which get 14ignore; I remembered this incorrectly).The difference is, even my old phone running Android 8 (a 9yo OS) can still browse the web, run all apps, and perform fine as a phone. An even older phone running Android 4.4 can still run 3rd party apps. iPhones seem to stop working about a year after they stop receiving updates, and they don’t support sideloading (also know as running the software you want to run on the device you own).
The oldest iPhone that can run the latest iOS is the 11 from 2019. Apple is still providing security fixes all the way back to iOS 15, which goes back to the 6s released in 2015. So, somewhere between 7 and 11 years for Apple depending on what you are counting as support. As a personal experience, my partners iPad from 2017 still runs fine, though it is stuck on iOS 16 and only gets security updates.
Are you sure about 14 years of support? I think Graphene basically supports things as long as Google does, due to reliance on their source code releases. Double that would be impressive.
Ah thanks, my bad; I must have remembered incorrectly. I’ve updated my original comment
Your Android 8 phone absolutely can not run every app lol. That’s a straight up lie that even people here won’t believe.
iPhones have the longest security update and os update plan out of any manufacturer.
Also worth noting that up until about 3 years ago finding an Android phone that was supported for even 4 years was almost impossible. Apple have been doing 6-7 years of full OS version updates and 8+ years of security updates almost since the start.
Oh trust me, I’m no fan of Samsung, but I tend to value control of my devices over…whatever it is Apple does. I had an iPhone until I discovered replacing the home button myself artificially bricked the device due to DRM forcing customers to go to an Apple store for repairs. Never again
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Long, but not longest. Fairphone is longer.
Just like the USB-c on the iphone
Even then, Apple maliciously complied. They put shit speed usb-c, (maybe 2.0?) on all but the highest most expensive model.
Tbf they also did that when they were on lightning.
And they are not the only one to do that. I have a flagship android phone one step before the super flagship but It only got usb 2. It is really annoying to transfer media at such a low speed.
I’ve read a couple stories of companies (planning to) release EU-only models there, but non-EU-compliant ones everywhere else.
The EU ones will become a lot more valuable on second hand markets…
I don’t think every corporation is as petty as nintendo
Interesting things that are not on the list:
- Farming equipment
- Motor and electric vehicles
- Computers (including laptops)
- Video game consoles
- HVAC systems and equipment
Not sure if smart TVs fall under “electronic displays”, or if they just mean commercial displays when they say that.
not yet ! we hope !
John deer tractor lost a case that became famous in my rural area (and elsewhere). It now have to let repair shop acces the tools and allow repair on its tractors.
I take the win ! And we continue to push forward in talks, petitions, actions and repairs (autorised or else) Support and/or use open source.
Farming equipment is a particularly annoying one, that and construction vehicles, are becoming increasingly locked down by proprietary software and impossible to maintain yourself. You can’t even employ mechanics outside the dealer network in some instances and it will be more so in the future.
yeah “farming equipment” is an important one. fuck john deere
microwave ovens…
in fact, make that all kitchen appliances.
I guess maybe microwaves are not on the list because they have big meaty capacitors that could be holding a charge still?
The idea is not repairability by the end users (those should never try to fix their microwave oven themselves) but to make repairs possible by any competent technician.
Considering the videos on youtube about creators disassembling and modifying them and the warnings creators like styropyro and The king of random did…I don’t think they should be serviced by the regular joe. Or the dangerous parts should be sealed of from the boring stuff like the buttons (e.g. door opener) so one trained technicians can reach it but the hurdle is big enough for normies.
Computers are not on it because you will never own one in the future. You will lease them.
Fact 😒
What exactly do you think you’d be able to easily repair on a video game console?
Consoles are just computers now.
Yes and no. Yes in terms of architecture, no in terms of repairability and design. How many computers have a SoC with soldered RAM? How many computers don’t let you upgrade the cpu or GPU? Good luck trying to repair the GPU or cpu or ram or SSD on a modern console. It’s just not feasible. Not because they don’t want you to, but because of how intricate and specialised they are. The parts that you could repair on a console are already easily repair/replaceable.
Broken ports, replace hard drive, replace memory, no software locks so custom software can keep it alive, replace battery (on a Switch for example).
Lots of thing right to repair could do for consoles.
I would hope that the Switch falls under “Tablets”. Because that’s exactly what it is.
A fat and weirdly shaped tablet, but I agree. I can do “switch” stuff by putting on an Abxylute or a Gamesir controller on a tablet.
Video consoles are either desktop computers with proprietary parts, or tablets with proprietary parts. There is nothing especially difficult to repair in them compared to the rest of their categories.
It would be especially hard to replace the RAM and SOC in them actually.
Yes, fair.
Well how about mobile phone, laptop or a tablet?
I’m not seeing easy written anywhere, it can still be done by experts but the idea I feel would be that its overall possible to accomplish by a third party.
For things like these I love Europe. For things like Chat Control I hate Europe
