First-person accounts of the attack and ISIS-style drive-through-a-crowd attack that ICE carried out can be found here:

  • peoplebeproblems@midwest.social
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    26
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    2 days ago

    It’s important to remember that the regime does not and will not have a superweapon it can use without severe consequences.

    It’s also important to remember that the agencies showing up to harm and intimidate vulnerable and disenfranchised populations are cowards and generally unintelligent.

    Protests are good. It gives them something to get angry about. The angrier they get, the dumber they act. They want violence. They want retaliation. The longer they don’t suffer casualties, the sooner they start making mistakes that cause them to weaken themselves.

    Be an obstruction. Ruin their equipment. Broadcast their names and faces. Shame them.

    If they resort to lethal force, it must not be responded to with violent resistance they expect. It must be unexpected resistance. It must make them question their actions. It must wake them up to the problem they have caused.

    • Drusas@fedia.io
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      16
      ·
      2 days ago

      I appreciate your point, but I would also point out that these fascists call graffiti ‘violence’ and even ‘terrorism’ (see the AG response to vandalism at Tesla dealerships).

      • peoplebeproblems@midwest.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        ·
        2 days ago

        They can call it whatever they want. They call protesting rioting and violence.

        I’m not talking about graffiti. I’m talking about making vehicles meant to carry victims to detention facilities inoperable.

    • SinAdjetivos@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      4
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 day ago

      Mostly with you until the last paragraph:

      If they resort to lethal force, it must not be responded to with violent resistance

      Do not ask others to Martyr themselves. Active self defense is as critical as anything. My advice is to avoid life or death situations as much as possible, but if you find yourself in one do whatever it takes to get out alive.

      It must make them question their actions. It must wake them up to the problem they have caused.

      You cannot force someone to change their mind, opinions, feelings etc. and here their livelihood, social status and self esteem is reliant upon them never changing their mind. You can however prevent those actions that cause harm, by force usually.

      The longer they don’t suffer casualties

      Casualties means killed, injured or otherwise incapacitated. I don’t disagree that injuries and death result in massive backlash of public opinion (it’s also why ICE, cops, etc also don’t immediately resort to lethal measures) but the goal in modern civil conflicts like this one (of both sides) is to maximize casualties of that third category.

    • NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      4
      ·
      2 days ago

      If they resort to lethal force, it must not be responded to with violent resistance they expect.

      Then what else? Because in such a situation you only have fight or flight.

      • peoplebeproblems@midwest.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        2 days ago

        There is no flight. There cannot be flight.

        You can’t fight tanks and automatic armed men with hunting rifles and handguns.

        Vehicles need fuel, oil, tires, maintenance, and certainly not sand or anything in the fuel tank. Thugs need food, water, ammunition, communication, and pay. Dispersal equipment needs electricity, chemicals, training.

        • NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          2 days ago

          Counterpoint: Syria. Also if it gets to that point a significant chunk of the military would instantly defect, so yeah. But let’s not jump the gun; for now this is still police and not particularly aligned semi-military forces. The national guard certainly shouldn’t be provoked for now, but ICE should be fought whenever and wherever they try to kidnap someone. If the resistance doesn’t protect its own members and their communities from ICE, it simply cannot survive.

  • ramble81@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    20
    ·
    2 days ago

    Do you want another Rodney King? Because that’s how you get another Rodney King.

    • Glitterbomb@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 day ago

      These police probably still use off the shelf DJI for surveillance. They probably can’t run EW because it’d knock their own drones out of the sky. Someone should check.

  • Five@lemmy.cafe
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    4
    ·
    2 days ago

    These demonstrators are heroes. I hope the people mowed down by unmarked ICE vehicles survive and ICE collapses under the lawsuits.

    • silence7@lemmy.worldOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      22 hours ago

      They used to. They don’t on vehicles made in roughly the last 8-10 years depending on manufacturer.

  • Lembot_0003@lemmy.zip
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    17
    arrow-down
    8
    ·
    2 days ago

    Americans: we have guns to be sure that… democracy… liberty… constitution… bla-bla-bla.
    Americans at the same time: what can we do? They have sticks and tear gas. And scary masks!

    • thesohoriots@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      18
      ·
      2 days ago

      Except as soon as one person pops off, every cop with the state-funded military gear will indiscriminately return fire because they really really want to use all of their bullets at once then go home and beat their spouses on paid leave.

    • rockstarmode@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      1 day ago

      I’m not sure if you’re familiar with US politics, but the Venn diagram intersection of people who have advocated for civilian firearm ownership AND resisting stricter immigration laws is vanishingly small.

      Mostly Democrats are upset about the current ICE push, but they also spent the last several generations trying to eradicate civilian firearm ownership, particularly in California.

      I’m on the side of of both more guns AND due process, but it wasn’t until recently that I’ve noticed traditional lefties waking up to why the second amendment is important.

      My hope is that the left remembers this feeling the next time they’re in power.

    • Truscape@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      6
      ·
      2 days ago

      This is California, the state with the strictest gun laws in the country on the books. You’re asking civilians with compliant arms to go up against literal military surplus equipment (provided through the 1033 program)?

      Also, nice bot username. Let’s see if you reply to any of the comments.

      • Lembot_0003@lemmy.zip
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        arrow-down
        4
        ·
        2 days ago

        Who said that police will dare to return fire? It is easy when you’re against one negro or a band of drunken bikers in the worst case. But fighting against people? Being in the minority? Nah…

            • shplane@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              1
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              1 day ago

              If not openly carrying a gun to a protest and risking my life makes me a coward, then yes, I agree. What if I told you there are better ways to disrupt the conservative agenda than flaunting a gun around a cop?

              • Lembot_0003@lemmy.zip
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                arrow-down
                2
                ·
                1 day ago

                There are many ways. Global strike, for example, if you’re a complete pacifist. But you won’t do that either. Because you “have a family to feed”.

                • shplane@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  22 minutes ago

                  Lots of assumptions you’re making, none of which are true, but something tells me that pointing that out to you is useless.

    • Drusas@fedia.io
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      2 days ago

      These people are going in with armored vehicles, SWAT gear, and military equipment. A single vigilante isn’t going to do shit other than get murdered and probably get everybody around them shot as well. We have to be smart about this. We have to be organized.

  • Rekorse@sh.itjust.works
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    5
    arrow-down
    10
    ·
    2 days ago

    Its nice that people want to help their neighbors but it still stands that the main reason California has so many undocumented immigrants rather than them being documented or naturalized is because its better for business to have cheaper labor that doesnt have to follow regulation or safety standards.

    • SinAdjetivos@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      6
      ·
      1 day ago

      Right, which is why ICE is currently cracking down and the list of those arrested include mostly C level individuals within those businesses like Stewart and Lynda Resnick, Elon Musk, Sundar Pichai, Doug McMillon, etc. for rampant, willful and contemptuous violations of the law.

      Oh, that’s not at all what’s happening? Huh, seems like you might be starting from a false premise.